The most experienced squam breeder I know says Atheris, or at least his, do not have pre-birth sheds. At the same time, there are a few other breeders that say they do. Has anyone here had any experiences with this? I'm curious what others have to say about this topic. Thanks.

Hey Brance. I talked to a few people I know that breed squams. They all said that they have not experienced any pre-birth sheds except on a few that litter was stil born. I personally have not experienced it yet as I have yet to produce my first squam litter, but hopefully soon. Interested to see what some of the others will have to say on the subject.

Anybody else?

Hey Brance hows it coming with those striped Jerdonii?

TJ, you must be confused, I have never kept that spp.

Derek, I know your thoughts on the subject and over anyone, I believe you. The reason I asked this to begin with is because I noticed awhile back where Frank agreed with Dan saying his squams did. My female has been off food now for several months and hasn't lost/gained any noticeable weight. If she is due to drop, it should be anytime now and last week she went into shed. I can't remember if she did this last year or not. I wish I would have taken better notes although I guess I'll find out soon enough.

Sorry Brance, My mistake it's another gentleman in Texas that has them.

Hi Brance. I only have experience from one litter of squams and the female shed it's skin over a month before dropping the babies..
BTW. I also notice (I was wondering this before but haven't really pay it much attention) that my female always shed it's skin twice a year and there is only two months between them, like this year the female shed it's skin on 27 July and again in 26 September. Have anyone else notice something like this.

Cheers
Sami

My personal experience is:

The most Colubrids and Elapids shed 10 - 30 days before giving birth.
Crotalids and Vipers shed mostly 5 - 20 days after giving birth!

Regards
Michael

I can actually agree with Michael more than I can with the folks who have seen pre-birth sheds with Atheris. I had two litters of squams and one litter of cerats late last year or early this year and the blackish female squam shed on May 20 and gave birth in November. She hasn't shed again. The bluish female squam shed on July 7 and gave birth in January. The cerat gave birth in September and then shed two days after birth. I have been breeding squams and chlorechis for about ten years now and I have never found a correlation between shedding and birthing with them. Either I am a loon and am completely off my rocker (which is highly probable), or other folks are having coincidental shedding occur that they associate with pre-birth shedding. There's no offense meant at anyone else, but that's the only way I can explain it.

My nitschei female is burstn with babies as I am typing she shed last week and is currently in shed again. What do you make of it Derek?

Congrats on the babies! Did you breed them or was she imported gravid? So she is shedding twice in two weeks? I've only seen that happen with animals that have had severe skin irritations of some sort and I find that very unusual for a healthy animal to do it. Are you certain she is shedding again, or did her eyes just cloud over? I have seen eyes cloud over but then they never shed. Perhaps she is doing that?

They are going to be a pay off for the last 2 years of preperation. I bred them from choice animals I aquired from various friends around the country that breed within there private collection. Like me, I don't sell any off my offspring except to close friends or reputable breeders with an established track record. Same in selecting all of my breeders and future breeders. As for the female she is in excellent health, but as I said she is going to shed it is very apparent in her color fade. On another note, I am excited to she what male took. I bred her with two different males to ensure copulation. She locked up with both males on many occassions. I hope the blue male took.

The lady with her tramps. She is the biggest on bottom right.

I'm a bit late for this conversation, but thought I'd chip in nonetheless.
In my experience, which of course is only a fraction from Derek's, is that there is no pre-birth shed in Atheris sp. At least not in squamigera or nitschei.

In fact, this Easter two of my A. squamigera females gave birth while both being in shed, gray.

Hey Timothy, any news on the gravid nitschei? The babies arrive yet?
Just out of curiosity, how can you see from the babies which male is the father? I might need that info sometime down the road, if I'm lucky

She shed today, but I am still not sure. We'll see what happens. I dont know what male she took to. She could be holding sperm from both so who knows.