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 popeiorum, stejnegeri

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April Mandel
Snakecharmer
Snakecharmer


Female
Number of posts: 117
Age: 61
Location: Eastern USA
Points: 444
Registration date: 2011-04-23

PostSubject: popeiorum, stejnegeri   Sun 8 May - 2:23

These were purchased in the 1980's as T. popeorum and T. stejnegeri. They were kept together for a week or so, and an accidental breeding resulted.



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Peter van Issem
Snakemaster
Snakemaster


Male
Number of posts: 436
Age: 44
Location: GERMANY
Points: 1543
Registration date: 2009-03-08

PostSubject: Re: popeiorum, stejnegeri   Sun 8 May - 2:35

Hi April,
the female on the picture looks for me not like an P.popeiorum or an V. stejnegeri. For me the female is an C. macrops, typical color, typical eyes, typical tail coloration.
The male? Not to see on this pic. Did you have better ones? But some of the males from P. fucata has such withish blotches on theire back. Sometimes I have seen them in juv. macrops too. The juv. on the picture looks strange for macrops, but matched for fucata. This year I have actually 16 offsprings from fucata, and some of them looks identical to your offspring.
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April Mandel
Snakecharmer
Snakecharmer


Female
Number of posts: 117
Age: 61
Location: Eastern USA
Points: 444
Registration date: 2011-04-23

PostSubject: Re: popeiorum, stejnegeri   Sun 8 May - 3:27

These specimens were obtained in the early-mid 1980's, a time when all Asian green tree vipers were Trimeresurus and the tree vipers from Central and South America were Bothrops. The unicolor Asian green tree vipers were mostly popeorum, stejnegeri, and albolabris. Macrops and fucata are unknown to me, when was the nomenclature revised to include them? Were they known in the mid 80's?

It's very possible that everything you say is correct. I'm very much aware that my knowledge of current nomenclature is terribly out of date, which is the reason I clearly state when the photo was taken or specimens obtained. Perhaps these additional photos can help.

The first was sold to me as T.popeorum, the next, T. stejnegeri, and then two more of the offspring.







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Peter Zürcher
Admin
Admin


Male
Number of posts: 870
Age: 60
Location: Carinthia, Austria
Points: 2886
Registration date: 2008-03-06

PostSubject: Re: popeiorum, stejnegeri   Sun 8 May - 3:36

Cryptelytrops macrops (Kramer 1977)
Popeia fucata (Vogel, David & Pauwels 2004)

Looks like a C. macrops to me too.

The paper by Malhotra & Thorpe (2004) leading to the split off of the "Trimeresurus-group"
http://pages.bangor.ac.uk/~bss024/pdfs/2004/Malhotra%20MPE%202004.pdf

regards
Peter

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April Mandel
Snakecharmer
Snakecharmer


Female
Number of posts: 117
Age: 61
Location: Eastern USA
Points: 444
Registration date: 2011-04-23

PostSubject: Re: popeiorum, stejnegeri   Sun 8 May - 3:49

Does anyone have photos of popeorum and stejnegeri? I'd like to see what they look like.
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Peter Zürcher
Admin
Admin


Male
Number of posts: 870
Age: 60
Location: Carinthia, Austria
Points: 2886
Registration date: 2008-03-06

PostSubject: Re: popeiorum, stejnegeri   Sun 8 May - 3:52

Viridovipera stejnegeri
http://www.google.at/search?q=Viridovipera%20stejnegeri&oe=utf-8&rls=org.mozilla:de:official&client=firefox-a&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&hl=de&tab=wi&biw=1184&bih=606
and
http://reptile-database.reptarium.cz/species.php?genus=Viridovipera&species=stejnegeri&search_param=%28%28species%3D%27stejnegeri%27%29%29

Popeia popeiorum
http://www.google.at/search?q=Popeia%20popeiorum&oe=utf-8&rls=org.mozilla:de:official&client=firefox-a&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&hl=de&tab=wi&biw=1184&bih=606

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